25 October 1944, LCdr. Ernest Evans, USS Johnston (DD-557), Taffy 3 screening destroyer, Battle off Samar.

Can’t seem to remember any fight that was ever won by running away – by design.

One final thing – We knew the 18 didn’t have the legs that the A6 or A7 did, meaning the carrier had to get closer to the troops we were tasked to support, and sometimes the ship isn’t on-station to offer that support like at Yankee Station off of Nam when we’d have to respond with an Alpha Strike….. To ensure our Opeval report was correct on this, we few a Hornet with all stations loaded with external drop tanks, flew them till they were empty and jettisoned the tanks to lighten the load and reduce air drag. Just didn’t have the legs, and nobody had to doctor the books to state facts.

Now for the meat of all this –

A few years after I PCS’d, ran into an old shipmate and of course, played the opposite of mustard – ketchup. The pilot that flew that hop – passed over, dead end job, got out. Not only was he a sh_t hot pilot while I knew him, he was a good division officer to his troops, well rounded individual. The Navy Brass wanted this airplane, and no amount of truth was going to slow down its purchase. I actually, truthfully wondered how many admirals had copious amounts of McDonald Douglas stock, or was promised jobs on their board of directors after they retired….. especially when (I believe) APU’s started blowing up killing pilots.

This just doesn’t seem too different.

But-but-but this patrol frigate doesn’t LOOK as cool as our littoral combat ship!

Cry me a river…. Back in the day, (1980) as an AK2, I done got stuck with the job of IMRL (aircraft special support gear) manager for my squadron just about the time we (VX-5) started the Opeval on the bomber version of the F/A-18. It was a mess – nobody prior to me had read the 13650 Inst. so as to be able to do it correctly for quite some time – and on top of trying to fix old problems, here comes all this new Hornet ‘push’ gear….. What a mess. Did I mention that I had just transferred from Light Attack – A-7’s? Not tooting my own horn – you guys would just laugh me off of this thread.

Well, there I am, hunched over my typewriter, banging out 306 custody cards for 1,375 line items (times three, of course) when into my cubby hole walks this suit. He introduces himself as a retired light commander working for McDonald Douglas and starts giving me a sales pitch for the –18, like I’m going to take out my checkbook and buy one for my carport and let my kid go without her milk…. Had five extended deployments under my belt, and knew most of the ‘Nam era carrier birds pretty well, and the A-7 extreamly well. This guy is extorting the virtues of the –18 like mad but made a tactical mistake – didn’t know his enemy (me - he interupted my worktime). Starts off telling me that it’d carry more ordnance than any other A/C on our fleet inventory, and by golly – had a shadow outlay of his pet to prove it. Did I mention five cruises – the last three Nam cruises of the Kitty Hawk, and seem to remember that VA-52 Knightriders with their A-6E Intruders made those same ones with me, plus one other, plus the two I had with VA-94 and our A-7’s. I didn’t need a shadow outlay of either attack bird to start asking him if the stations he was pointing to were mers or ters, and how many MK-84 iron bombs was carried on each station….. then we started discussing mileage and things really went downhill…. Back in the day, the 18 was good to go – only to the next gas station, that is. Dam good way to PROJECT power – build gas stations. He wasn’t a happy camper when he left – neither did he try to sell me a bird. Shame, I wanted to see what kind of discount he was going to give me. Have to admit, two motors are always better than one, bombing accuracy was a skosh better (-18 = 15ft, -7 = 25 ft, 500 pound (and bigger) bomb = doesn’t matter), pilot-pit (real word not allowed) laid out much better, maintenance access much better, goes to easier, faster maintenance.

Regardless - - - the only thing I have typed is current legal reality. You, not so much. You have not added one thing of value with any post you've made on this entire thread. Responding to meaningless typing is not worth missing a rerun of The Big Bang Theory. TTFN

‘Suppose’ a frog had wings..... gravity IS right. 215 IS law.

And I should have added - 'Your point?' - That is, besides making noise.

Regardless of either it’s name or constitutionality, it has been signed into law, and until it’s challenged and defeated in a court of law, it’s current legal existence renders ‘Guest’s’ post as inaccurate.

Not anymore. You might want to read Section 215 (Access to records and other items under FISA) of the USA PATRIOT Act, Title II. That thing that Pres. Obama not only extended, but enhanced by signing 215 into law.......

JM, thanks for the compliment. Sorry it took me so long to respond, was out of town for a while. You might not see this handle much anymore as KOMO banned me 2 months ago for defending myself (WITHOUT breaking their rules- I used the phrase ‘foot in your mouth’). I’ve contested it to them (twice), but they don’t even have the manors to ‘auto’ reply. Might create a new handle (d2), but it’s also kind of nice NOT reading the news as much as I was….(an addiction to news??????)

Haven’t heard of too many situations where a body was shot for KNOCKING on your front door….