gdp's Comments

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 16:45:16 +0000

Maybe if you and her didn't share thoughts on bootstraps...?

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 08:33:48 +0000

Sorry, I don't speak Randroid.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 03:27:17 +0000

Oh GODS, I'd almost forgotten about that silly "PaganD" nonsense. :-(

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 03:21:31 +0000

See, there you go again. In effect, you are saying that one should not be offended by someone heaping suspicion of neo-Nazism on others unless one is oneself a neo-Nazi. Do you really not see how this an attempt to use innuendo, in an almost McCarthy-like manner, to silence someone who disagrees with you? It is shameful. This. Seriously, I'm one of the last people on Earth who's be a racist, and this insinuation of hidden racism among recons severely annoys me, to put it lightly. Yeah, I know some racist groups will use slick language to paint it as a somehow "kinder, gentler racism", but I distance myself from that. The other recons I'm friendly with (both in and outside Hellenism) distance themselves from that. In fact, I've argued profusely with people about how ancient practise really wasn't so "pure" as some people like to think (especially in Hellas -- but only really cos that's what I know). ETA: For serious. My father's family is Ultach and my mother's is Cornish & Cockney. I'm a Hellenist, cos those are the gods I feel closest to; I've known non-whites who are Hellenists or Romans -- and most of the Kemetics I've met don't appear Middle Eastern in "genetics". Reconstructed religions can be practised by anybody -- some feel a close bond or calling to worship the gods of their ancestors, others feel that bond to the gods of other tribes.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 03:09:05 +0000

Add extreme Folkishness to that mentality and - oh, yes, we've seen where that leads, haven't we: "we're purer/our religion is purer/our group is purer than anyone else." Sieg, baby.. umm... excuse me? As some-one whose religious practise is based on reconstructionist methodology, I really resent that straw man. Yeah, OK, Hellenism and Religiio probably have the lowest rate of that I've seen amongst other recon paths (makes sense, I guess -- ancient Hellas defined "Hellenes" as anybody who spoke the local language fluently, and Rome would let any free man, and certain classes of free women, who applied and paid taxes be a Roman), but you're still lumpng all recons together, and yet you seem surprised, shocked, that there are recons who resent Popular/Eclectic Wicca? I've seen nobody in all this go on about "purity". I know that mentality exists, but nobody in Patheos' link round-up has had that sort of mentality. I've seen nobody simply linked there in the comments with that mentality. This is the worst kind of ad hominem, and not to mention a bad case of poisoning the well. Thanks! >:-|

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 02:31:47 +0000

This. And thanks for putting it better than I was feeling up to. It's like, I can't deny that the Romans suppressed *some* cults, but bringing up interpretatio romana is a bit nonsense -- it was seldom enforced onto native cults, and it was generally understood that's just what Romans did, that's how they reasoned that all the world could be Roman, if they wanted to: "Ah, we see your Maponos is like your version of our Apollo -- Who's Greek, but we liked Him, so obviously He's a Roman god." Huge difference between that along with the occasional suppression of a cult that threatened Rome's political power and destroying the temples of "idolaters" where "false gods" are worshipped en masse. Compared to Christianity, polytheistic Rome suppressed almost nothing (almmost).

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sun, 5 Jun 2011 02:14:06 +0000

You assume I have resources. What gives you that impression?

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:41:20 +0000

Here, perhaps you should familiarise yourself with how the word "pagan" is actually used. You act like I am suggesting that you have no choice not to be called a Pagan, please believe me I am not trying to imply that. Uhh... hon, when you say: Every one of us here are Pagans like it or not. None of us worship the Judea-Christian God & to be honest it doesn't matter if you like the definition or not.[link] ...you haven't implied that -- you've outright stated it.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:35:08 +0000

I admit, part of what influenced my decision to reject the term "pagan" is plain contrariness. "What's that? You say I 'should' do This? Screw you!! MWAHAHAHAHA!!!" Ahhh! It feels goooooood!!! ;-)

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:31:24 +0000

I worship the Theoi (the gods and goddesses and hemitheoi and earth-bound daimons recognised by ancient Hellas), and I am not a pagan. I reject the term as a Christian slur, and as one that may only be rightfully "reclaimed" by those who feel closest to the Divine in the woodlands or countryside -- not by those, like myself, who are spiritually enriched by large cities.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:23:52 +0000

Pagans are adamantly not evangelistic; we don't wanna drag anyone kicking and screaming in off the street! We only want people here who want to be here. Considering the number of times I've been told by self-identified "pagans" that my religion, despite any reservations I may have against calling it such, is "really pagan", I'd say you're very well out-of-touch with the growing and changing face of modern Pagans and their community. We're happy to get along with everyone--even non-Pagans. We're OK with Christians, Jews, Moslems, Buddhists, Heathens, Atheists, Agnostics, Humanists, and even non-Pagan Witches. So... Whether we like it or not, everybody else is "pagan"? [sighs tiredly]

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:13:12 +0000

So are you saying that some gods are older than other gods? Eh, I think it's less than and more the "poetic sense" of Old Gods. Like the concept of "Old World, New World" -- obviously, there was a wealth of evidence at the time of European first-contact with the Americas that those lands had been there for at least as long as the Old World, but the New World was simply "new" to Western consciousness.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:08:39 +0000

The "old Gods," eh? And you wonder why Heathens and other Reconstructionists are reluctant to come on board with the Pagan label. Interpretatio hellenica and interpretatio romana, respectively, on the part of Greeks and Romans does not sameness of gods throughout cultures make. Agreed -- and I'm a Hellenist, but I also know the difference between the chauvinism of certain ancient Attic philosophers and genuine respect for other cultures and their deities.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 20:05:42 +0000

...including those who did so before the Christians came along... Uh... Source? Your blog doesn't count, by way way, Curt -- unless, of course, a particular entry cites its sources and they're easily verifiable.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 19:58:23 +0000

...sometimes as whole-cloth as the gods of the Celts were, given Roman names and forced into their pigeonholes Cos modern self-defined "pagans" are *so much better* concerning this? Pfft.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 18:31:10 +0000

Just to quibble a bit: Pre-Christian Rome was actually astoundingly tolerant of the religions of the tribes they conquered -- as much as Recons like to tout that the ancient Mediterranean had religion deeply interwoven into the average person's entire life, there are clearly examples of separation of religion, culture, and politics. Rome conquered tribes politically, but after the final battles, arrangements for taxes were made, and tribes were generally allowed to resume to 'business as usual". While the establishment of said as a new "Roman colony" often carried ill effects on the social classes (such as well-educated and formerly wealthy Hellenes resorting to be sold into slavery cos now there's no money), cultural religions were allowed to thrive -- at least with the assumption that lip-service would be paid to the cult of the Emperor. Furthermore, even in Hellas, there were "free cities" peppered about the otherwise "conquered" land -- sure, "free" usually meant so much as long as they aligned with Rome, politically, but these were thus technically cities not of the Roman empire. Comparing pre-Christian Rome to the later "Holy Empire" is severely intellectually dishonest, as it conflates Rome's acquisition of taxed lands with Christianity's veritable cultural genocide.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 18:00:05 +0000

I don't think "interesting" is the word I'd use -- it's kind of sad, actually, and indicative of both racisms faced and Wiccan privilege (albeit slight).

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 16:02:54 +0000

Brenda, I assume that "Pagan Every Day" is some kind of calendar or planner and (as such things do) comes from a particular publisher. http://www.amazon.com/Pagan-Every-Day-Extraordina... Not a calendar, published by Weiser books. Found this out in 0.26 seconds. You're welcome. You see, this problem exists considerably beyond Llewellyn Publishing.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 08:32:57 +0000

...but no, it's not going to either get the Dominionists off our backs... Who is under that delusion? I've seen no such claims, so if you've seen something I've missed, please source it. Otherwise, you're arguing straw-men.

The Wild Hunt : The Pagan Terminology Discussion Continues

Sat, 4 Jun 2011 08:30:31 +0000

Nobody is under any such delusion -- nice straw man, but I think it's getting a little worn out.