gdp's Comments

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Fri, 28 May 2010 18:19:46 +0000

strongly seconded!

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Fri, 28 May 2010 18:08:50 +0000

yes, it really gets hard to define if one doesn't use the legal concept, since in english we don't seem to have a simple and clear word for someone under the age of consent.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Fri, 28 May 2010 18:03:48 +0000

the age of majority is 21 in mississippi and 19 in nebraska and alabama.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Wed, 26 May 2010 19:42:00 +0000

i think using the words child/children and adult is problematic. one's own implicit understanding of what the words means isn't necessarily the same as another person's. child can mean an infant, someone prepubescent, someone under the age of consent, someone under the age of majority, someone's offspring, someone younger than one, someone who isn't fully grown, etc. even minor is problematic, since it means someone under the legal age of majority according to their own laws -- and that varies from 14 to 21 just in first world countries. adult can mean someone past puberty, someone out of school, someone over the age of consent, someone over the age of majority, someone legally recognised as an adult, someone married, someone fully grown, etc. legally, in parts of the world (including much of canada and part of the usa) an 18 year old is a minor, not an adult; in other places (such as scotland or american samoa) a 16 year old is an adult, not a minor. i recognise that the mix of cultures and countries makes it harder to write what we mean so that it's explicit and clear, but since the statement is meant to appeal to pagans from many parts of the world, i think it would be best to avoid statements that would be unethical to some. while it's more unweildy, perhaps using terms like age of consent and age of majority rather than adult and child would causae less confusion.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Wed, 26 May 2010 19:26:18 +0000

"As minors are legally unable to give consent to sexual activities, we consider all sexual actions with minors to be non-consensual, and therefore they are not to be tolerated within our community." except that's untrue most places; age of majority and age of consent aren't the same. one can legally give consent to sex whenever one is over the legal age of consent according to the laws one is subject to. in most of europe, oceania, and north and south america, age of consent varies from 14-18, sometimes depending on gender. a minor is anyone under the age of majority (the age at which one assumes all the responsibilities of adulthood; if one is an emancipated minor the rules are also different) in one's country/culture/jurisdiction. in the same areas age of majority ranges from 14 to 21. in new zealand age of majority is 20; most of the uk 18 (scotland 16); most of canada 19; in australia and most of the usa 18 (with a few exceptions that range from 15 to 21 in the usa). but in nz, scotland, and canada age of consent is 16; australia and the usa it varies from 16 to 18.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Wed, 26 May 2010 03:24:14 +0000

as i mentioned earlier in this thread, i'm a survivor of severe childhood sexual abuse. a statement against sexual abuse is very much about me and my experience -- just as it's about everyone who's been affected by sexual abuse. if that's 'stupid drama' to you, i'm very glad i don't know you. eta: thaks, admin, for deleting that attack; it really threw me!

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Tue, 25 May 2010 21:59:36 +0000

you're welcome :)

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Tue, 25 May 2010 20:03:59 +0000

ananta_of_maine, the interaction i'm aware of is athttp://www.brendanmyers.net/wickedrabbit/index.ph... in that forum redbird posted a thoughtful and detailed breakdown of draft #4. juniper's first response -- posted from a moderator accct -- was "Wow two pages of grammatical corrections is a little OCD/anal retentive/creepy" redbird took exception (rather politely, imo), and juniper's next response -- again, posting from a moderator acct and speaking in the royal "we" to emphasise her role as moderator -- said in part, "While we appreciate your efforts here, you do come across as abrupt, domineering and with a "high and mighty", "I know better than you", "I'm right and you're wrong" attitude." fwiw, after reading the fora on the draft statement, that's not the impression i got at all. nor do i know either redbird or juniper, so i have no preconceived ideas about either of them.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Tue, 25 May 2010 05:11:01 +0000

"And for the record I wasn't acting as a moderator when I made those posts, I was just posting as myself. " perhaps that was unclear? my experience is with fora where one posts as a moderator (signified by one's title, avatar, etc) to speak as a moderator; mods also have separate accts for private use. you feel the ethics statement isn't about any of us?

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Tue, 25 May 2010 00:49:02 +0000

going by the legal meansing, private groups and individuals *can't*, since it's a rule for the govt. but if you mean in general, should a person or group have control over what soemone says? my general rule for myself is that if i'm in someone else's space (their home, their business, their gathering, their website, etc), i know that they get to make the rules and it's up to me to either respect them or leave -- and if they're in my space, i expect them to respect my rules or leave. so if a group says "you can't talk about x here", it's my choice. i can stay and not talk about x, or i can leave and talk about x elsewhere.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 23:46:28 +0000

"Redbird has never asked for an apology, explanation or contacted me about them. Though she did write to Brendan as if he were my daddy." but if you say write something objectionalbe to someone who then notes it publicly where you and others see it, it's your ethical responsibility to take the next step. it is not the responsibility of the person you insulted to "ask for an apology". and fwiw, someone writing to the owner of a website to complain about your behaviour as a moderator on that site is hardly treating the website owner as your father. it's the acceptable thing to do when a moderator does something objectionable on a website; you notify the admins.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 23:27:05 +0000

re "free speech" -- are you referring to u.s. first amendment rights? the first amendment says that *the government* shall make no law "abridging the freedom of speech"; it has nothing to do with what private groups and individuals can do.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 23:11:15 +0000

ah, okay, that's more like the us hate speech laws -- what juniper wrote ("Going around and telling people that someone is a sexual predator and they should ostracize, or harm, her/him, without proof and without him/her being actually charged or convicted with a crime, can get you charged for Hate Speech.") sounded like the laws were quite different. thank you for the clarification.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 21:52:40 +0000

are you saying that in canada if someone behaved in a sexually predatory way toward me, but not in a way that would hold up in court (groping me when no one else was around, threatening me with no witnesses, etc), and i warned my friends and associates about hir behaviour, that that's illegal under canadian law? if that's true, this is the first time in my life that i've been glad my ggrandfather renounced his canadian citizenship.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 21:46:23 +0000

thanks, jason.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 04:32:54 +0000

::passes over asbestos underdrawers::

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 01:02:40 +0000

heee! one of my friends posted recently about "what if architects were treated like web designers":http://www.intercomm.co.za/articles/architects.ht...

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 00:54:47 +0000

fwiw, i'm glad you took on this project. no, it's not a fun topic, nor an easy one. not only is pleasing all (or even most) of a vast and dirverse group difficult at best, but then there are all sorts of unexamined cultural assumptions and implicit messages that can be tricky to avoid. it's definitely a subject many people are very passionate about. and that's a good thing -- even though i'm sure it's very uncomfortable to be the one sitting in the hot seat. (oooh, modern pagan heraldry sounds fascinating! i know nothing about heraldry; the memory biggest in my mind is when a local sca fellow in the 70s or 80s got a shield approved that was a crescent moon iwth 2 stars. nothing out of the ordinary -- until he appeared in public with it and it became very obvious that turned sideways it was really a smiley face. i believed the rules were rather tightened after that... )

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 00:13:19 +0000

exactly. unfortunately too many people grow up being taught that saying "i didn't mean *that*" or "but i said i was sorry!" put an end to the matter rather than being the first step in mending matters.

The Wild Hunt : An Ethics Statement: Public Comment Period

Mon, 24 May 2010 00:11:17 +0000

"One of the contributors suggested that something should be said about vindictive accusations of sexual abuse." again i'll suggest that it's pretty normal to feel vindictive towards someone who's harmed one. it's also far too common for people who've been assaulted to find that they're not believed because the perp is more popular, higher status, etc., and is believed when insist say they didn't do anything wrong adn that the victim is the one lying. "It would have been nice to have seen this particular criticism sooner" i'm sorry no one else caught them sooner as well, and i'm glad that anon posted when sie did and that the person who quoted hir posted about it. i look forward to seeing the next iteration of the statement, and i'm glad you and your team are taking comments on the especially troubling aspects of the draft to heart. ~s