I find in increasingly hard to understand why Remainers continue to fight a battle that was won two years ago, to stay in an organisation that increasingly looks doomed. To be blunt those guys are attempting to hoodwink the public and should be ashamed of themselves, whatever party they belong to. The terms of our departure were spelled out by the government in that infamous leaflet we all paid for. That's what we voted for, not to allow Parliament to change them because members think they know best.
The EU is past saving, unless perhaps it reverts to a Common Market again.
Your main points are correct. If the elites of the continent and the UK had no so ruthlessly ignored the working people in pursuit of personal gain, there would have been no need for "populist parties", the only way most of us could usefully campaign for change.
I have personally watched, with annual visits for several years, the sharp decline in the economy of one Itallian
Port city. Much industry moved to eastern Europe. Sub Saharan migrants swamp the streets selling trash, wages undercut. Shops closed. No wonder they have a "populist" government now. This is what the EU has done to the working people of the continent, including us.
Interesting to campare the things Remainers said about the NHS on that battle bus, to what the PM now claims.
Typical politicians. perceptions are far more important than truth it seems.
Love to see the end of Merkel but as an ex Ukiper I warn you to be careful what you wish for with Afd. They are way to the right of how we used to be and I don't trust them. Mind you, I'm not sure I trust the way UKIP or you guys are moving these days.
After years as a somewhat left wing Tory I joined UKIP, ending up as a branch chairman. I left after the party lurched to the right during the Bolton affair. I spent 5 years fighting for and helping win the referendum, so there was simply no way I could return to the Conservatives after the debacle of May's leadership and many of your MPs trying to stop meaningful Brexit.
I still have an elected position and now I'm Independent. May I suggest that you all need to pressure your government and Remain MPs into grasping that we had one vote on the EU and don't need any more, in Parliament or elsewhere. I can quite see large numbers of Tories and ex Tories abstaining in any future election, thus letting Corbyn slip in.
So far you are doing spectacularly badly.
Cameron thought he could change the EU. He failed.
Cameron thought he could sell his deal to the public. He failed.
May thought she could increase her majority. She failed.
May thinks she can negotiate with the EU. No chance madam.
Most of Parliament thinks they can scupper Brexit. Stop, it won't work, you will divide the nation so badly that the consensus between these who govern and the people will be broken for ever. It will also destroy the Conservative party and possibly lead to a labour government, a far more damaging prospect than any bumps in the road Brexit could bring.
The people voted and you promised to honour the result. Get on with it and stop procrastinating.
Interesting. I used to be UKIP, left after the Bolton's lady friend's remarks that were the last straw. Pleased that I did, they have now gone stark raving mad. I am now an Independent local councillor and find to my surprise that I'm now the most left wing member of my nearly totally Tory council. Jacob has some good points but if he becomes Tory leader I fear for your future. There would be one big divide between Left and Right, I doubt the country is ready for that.
Where are national heroes when you want them, I know Boudica was not fond of Italians, Drake of the Spanish, Churchill of the Germans, Wellington of the French and even that King Arthur.... As you say pointless. However, we have spent much of our history avoiding being taken over by European powers, until the last 40 years.
There was a TV programme on votes for women recently. The attitude of the political establishment to that campaign, just over 100 years ago, was astounding. They were convinced they knew best and actually tortured women who fought for democracy.
It seems to me that attitude continues even today. We must stay in the EU and that end justifies any means. The people can't be trusted to make important decisions.
Either we live in a democracy or we don't. If Corbyn wins the next election I look forward to us all calling for a re-run on the basis that the public did not know what they were doing.