en-us https://www.intensedebate.com/users/774745 Comments by bigpicview http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59133565 I like to use the analogy of what the digital camera did to the chemical film development industry in just a few short years to illustrate the magnitude of what's about to happen in the inter exchange carrier marketplace. Even Kodak, didn't see it coming and barely made it into the new age of digital camera because of that shortsightedness. This is the level of change that an inexpensive indoor digital architecture will bring to a utility currently based on a pole and wire architecture. And just as you can do far more with a digital camera than simply taking pictures, you will be able to do far more with a Voiparty connection box than just connecting long distance calls. And one big difference is that individual entrepreneurs were not offered a business opportunity with the rollout of digital cameras. CIC will be in place in short order. Check back because as soon as it's here I will be asking Troy to move this thread out from under the SCAM ALERT tab. Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:37:03 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59133565 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59133543 If you think VoiParty is primarily about competing in the low cost long distance market you have missed the vision of the company. Will they have low cost long distance? Sure... as one of many value propositions but not their only one and ultimately not their main one. So many people just can't see beyond the immediate picture of long distance phone service. They don't get how buiding a continent wide indoor digital telephone network is going to not only transform an existing utility but will create an entirely new way to deliver digital products and services. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:36:49 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59133543 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130510 So what it comes down to MIke, is that the way you make a sale to a robot is different than the way you make a sale to a human. But we are still making a sale. It's just a lot easier. You talk to a human with your voice. "Hey, would you like to buy your long distance minutes for less?" Maybe the person will say yes. You talk to a robot with your connection box. "Hey, we've got the lowest cost for minutes over here in this little box." Definitely the robot will say yes. The bottom line is a choice was made to go with the least cost bidder and a toll was charged for the call- a sale was made. VoiParty's brilliant innovation is to seamlessly integrate within an existing system so that all sales are assured. If this model is something that you wish to doubt or Troy wishes to warn against, so be it. The Wright brothers were told they would never fly too. Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:54:33 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130510 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130495 The buying decision made by a human being was made a long time ago when they agreed to be a part of this systemitized approach to switching calls down the least cost route. That human being was operating in the capacity of a corporate officer whose fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders is to deliver the highest level of profitability possible. By deciding to incorporate as company who's main product is call delivery they entered into the robotic system that was established by the industry regulators after the breakup of the Bell monopoly. The power to make the buying decision was authorized to the robot by a human. "Yes, robot, we trust you to connect every one of our subscriber's calls for the least cost possible. Go and do our bidding." (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:54:22 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130495 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130434 As far as "no selling" is concerned, I suggest you go to the other VoiParty thread here at the Helpdesk and read up on how VoiParty members make sales. This is "one for the books" as VoiParty's 21st century business model has opened up a whole new area that doesn't fit existing sales models. You could think of it like this: VoiParty is selling to "a robot." The robot has been programmed to connect long distance calls via the least cost route offered. Vendors compete for the business by uploading their particular cost per minute into the robot's data base. All phone companies seeking to deliver long distance calls outside of their own infrastructure use the robot to find them the best deal available for each call. The robot 's operation systemetizes the marketplace and makes sure every phone company optimizes their profitibility. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:53:29 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59130434 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59129841 Hi Mike, From your comments I don't think you've checked in on a company presentation for quite a while. The word investment was removed a long time ago (and a thank you to Troy is in order for pointing it out so it could be corrected). Mike, have you ever made a mistake? Most humans have. VoiParty corrected that mistake when it was brought to their attention. (You can see my comments about the colloquial context they were speaking in when they first used the word at the very beginning of this comments thread. Of course they weren't offering an investment as the SEC would define that word. That's ridiculous). (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:46:03 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/01/19/mlm-wireless-voip-news-voiparty-mlm-pyramid-or-mlm-company/#IDComment59129841 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067803 Way back at the beginning of the original thread on this topic you sang the praises of Scott Warren as being a very together MLM lawyer. Yes, VoiParty is a different kind of business than anyone has ever seen before but if Scott is leading the legal team then that would indicate to me that he believes this can be done. I do appreciate the healthy debate that we've been having as it has allowed me to go into enough detail to communicate how different this is from anything that has ever come before. Making automated sales to a central computer that has been programmed to find the lowest price to deliver a call for all the big phone companies is pure genius and so outside the box that it challenges everyone to see that we now have something that's broken the mold. Work smart, not hard. Plug in a box and get paid. Invite others to do the same and get paid more. Energetic, early adopters are coridally invited to get on board early. More conservative lay back and watch types are cordially invited to come in whenever they feel comfortable enough. Sun, 28 Feb 2010 07:01:09 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067803 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067735 No other inter-exchange carrier can compete with VoiParty's indoor digitial telephone model where each member pays the maintainence fees because they are all outdoor pole and wire based delivery systems that they must carry the costs on. OK if you have to keep telling your readers that they'd better beware of something that's never been done before. That's OK. Everyone has to decide what their own risk tolerence is anyway. The thing I object to is placing it under the title SCAM ALERT. It may be new and it may be different but no one is trying to scam anybody... deliberately or by default of ignorance. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 06:59:57 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067735 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067670 That's what we VoiParty members sell- the cheapest connection fees. It happens within an entirely automated system where the customers have already agreed to pay the lowest rate. A central computer system called Least Cost Routing first detects each long distance call as to where and when it originates, where it is headed. It then scans the vendor bids for where that call needs to be connected and swithches the call through the lowest bidder's lines. If it just so happens that there's a VoiParty box near where that call is going to be connected then that member's box is going to make the sale because VoiParty is going to be the lowest cost bidder by far. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 06:58:41 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067670 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067586 Now how do I go about making these sales as a VoiParty member? By choosing to plug in my box and choosing to leave it plugged in and active by paying for the electricity, the high speed modem and the copper line. CHOOSING to maintain my box live is how I make sales. Keeping a box maintained and live takes an action, the action of making sure I pay my electric, highspeed and copper line bills. I realize it takes a real mind snap to get that the act of plugging in the box insures that you will make a random number of sales per month to a whole bunch of different phone companies looking for the cheapest connection toll in your area. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 06:57:03 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067586 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067391 What do you mean we are not selling a service to someone outside the compensation structure? Of course we are. The only thing is it all takes place automatically and our customers are the big phone companies. You plug the device into the system and everytime a call comes within proximity it gets routed through the box. The minutes are timed and a toll is charged. That's a sale. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 06:54:24 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59067391 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052224 Yes, the trend is underway that ALL telecom costs are dropping. I'm amazed that you don't see that VoiParty's market share comes from making them drop more than anyone else can. We get paid exactly for saving other companys a lot of money. This industry is a market of tremendous scale. When you are dealing with a volume of 15 billion minutes a month that's a whole lot of pennies to be making but remember, this wholesale minutes business is just the launching pad to establish the platform for all the other digital products and apps to come in the next phase. And yes, there will be a whole retail market to capitalize on as well as another revenue stream. Free long distance for life to the US& Canada for the one time cost of about 6-10 months of an average long distance bill. Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:29:56 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052224 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052207 Point 3.- Troy, you wouldn't expect KFC to show you the Colonel's secret spice recipe just because you asked, would you? What company in their right mind would reveal their trade secrets when they are just about to transform an industry? Besides, I can't show you the beta test results because I'm not privy to them but I have no reason to believe that they haven't been established. Why would a company go to the effort and expense of launching this particular business model if they didn't have the central computer and servers dialed in and ready to manage the system? After 4 months of studying what has been laid out in the VoiParty vision I have nothing but great admiration and respect for Joe Machado, Ciro Martinez, Paul Jorgensen, Joe Lopez and all the other corporate team members. These guys have spent a ton of money getting this ready to fly and they are going to carry the costs until it becomes self sustaining. This is not a frivolous endeavor. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:29:40 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052207 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052116 Point 2.- Again, this is really a horse of a different color business model. Think of it like this: If you were a plumber you would need to have a a pipe wrench to ply your trade. You buy the wrench one time and then every day you use it to turn pipes and you charge for what you do with your wrench every day. Ka ching. A VoiParty member pays for their indoor telephone pole one time and then plugs it in on their desk where it goes to work routing other peoples long distance calls on a daily basis. It's a little money making wrench that turns itself another turn every time a call comes in its proximity. Ka ching. The plumber makes money by turning his wrench. The VoiParty member makes money by plugging in their connection box. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:28:28 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59052116 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051884 Also, I want to remind everybody that entry into the wholesale long distance minutes market is merely the way VoiParty is establishing the nation wide network of pole locations. Once they are in place the next level of the business plan kicks in. The boxes now collectively form a platform and conduit down which a wide array of commisionalble digital products and applications can be delivered while the wholesale minutes revenue stream continues to run in the background. Things like wireless tv, cellular VOIP, low cost intenet connection at G10 speed, smartphone apps and things that haven't even been invented yet. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:25:42 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051884 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051821 So is there a product or service? VoiParty members supply a service to the all the phone companies needing to connect the long distance calls of their subscribers by giving them a lower cost connection alternative to the existing outdoor pole and wire system. The connection boxes sit at the ready to route calls that happen to come within their proximity. Troy, your "what if" about the comp plan going away and everybody staying with the service because the cost is next to nothing doesn't take into consideration the fact that the members ARE the network and as such have the power to refuse such a bait and switch deal. By simply pulling the plug out of the wall the members can bring the company to its proverbial knees because they are nothing without their ability to deliver calls. The members ARE the ability to deliver calls. Not that the company would ever try to do that to the members but since you brought it up... (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:24:46 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051821 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051719 1.3 million members saying "Yes, I will give this little box a space on my desk to work from. I will pay for it's 110v power as part of my electric bill. I will pay for it's ability to receive a VOIP signal as part of my monthly high speed modem charge and I will pay for a regular copper phone line to deliver the long distance calls of all the other phone companies to their last mile" is what builds the world's first cross country indoor digital phone company and spreads the physical infrastructure operating costs equally among the individual members which leaves the company having only to carry the operating expenses of the central computers, servers, staff and offices. In exchange for being an indoor telephone pole location VoiParty compensates the individual members with a portion of the money saved on not having to maintain the legacy infrastructure the way an outdoor pole and wire company must. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:23:30 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051719 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051554 Point 1.- Now you are starting to penetrate in to how the VoiParty business model is neither fish nor fowl when it comes to fitting in to previously existing structures that can be easily classified. VoiParty members are not direct revenue sources to the VoiParty company as members of another company might be through an autoship or monthly subscription model. They are a conduit to a revenue stream that exists outside the company. Each member supplies an entry point from that stream that feeds back to the company who then feeds back 70% of the revenues received to the membership for the part they play in creating the system. The VoiParty members ARE the network. It may take a little bit of thinking to get one's head wrapped around this highly unusual structure and what it actually means. Each member's DECISION to puchase a connection box is what establishes the network. Once the decision is made the box goes to work harvesting revenue from the already exisiting $800M per month wholesale long distance minutes market. (cont. next post) Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:21:32 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment59051554 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment58734179 Each box becomes a single point in a network that will spread across the whole North American continent as part of the first phase of a planned 1.3 million connection boxes. (The 10 thousand that Troy mentions in his video was a number that was going around as the break even point for the company to hit before actual profitablity was reached). After 1.3 million they may decide to place more in the network but they will cross that bridge later. But it's not a problem because once VoiParty settles the North American continent we move internationally where the target is 20 million boxes. And what else seems to be sailing over most people's heads is the fact that VoiParty's business plan is so much more than just capturing wholesale long distance business. This part of establsihing the network is only the way it will be created. Then the real fun begins as they offer all kinds of other commissionable digital products and applications. Like I said, most people don't get what this is. Fri, 26 Feb 2010 02:25:30 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment58734179 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment58734156 Glad to see another educated voice in this discussion, Peter. There's just enough on the surface about Voiparty so as to appear like just another long distance provider that most people miss what's actually happening. But you said it so clearly, the customers are actually the big telephone companies. Even Robin and Troy haven't snapped to the fact that VoiParty not paying for recruiting. We have a product that is a direct sale. Reps invite others to purchase a connection box and place it in their homes. Once the product is set up and turned on it starts to divert money out of an already existing $80M per month revenue stream. We make our money from the people who are NOT in VoiParty and there are millions and milions more people in that demographic than in our company. Light bulbs going on yet? (cont. next post) Fri, 26 Feb 2010 02:25:16 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/17/mlm-help-desk-responses-to-voiparty-top-distributor/#IDComment58734156