IntenseDebate - DiscoveredJoys

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: Remainer... · 0 replies · +1 points

I think you speak too kindly about Campbell.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: Remainer... · 0 replies · +1 points

Leave first, then engage in a bunch of small deals to sort things out. This would fulfil the Referendum and allow some wiggle room to retain desirable relationships with the EU to mollify Remainers.

And then once we have sovereignty again we can address the desires of Scotland and Northern Ireland.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: Remainer... · 0 replies · +1 points

Quite so. From the article "The obvious message from these elections is that the electorate is divided and in an increasingly bitter fashion. " The other message that many politicians are deliberately refusing to address is that a Brexit In Name Only, or a soft non-Brexit, a 'confirmatory' referendum, or another extension to the Article 50 process, cannot reach an solution acceptable to all. We are (politically) back to Leave or Remain, there is no 'fudge' option.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Lord Ashcroft: My EU e... · 1 reply · +1 points

And what would the question(s) of a second referendum be? May's 'deal' is dead in the water, the EU are unlikely to offer a different deal while we are still in the EU, and we have already answered the basic Remain/Leave question. On top of that you also have the suspicion of many of the referendate that the 'results' might not be honoured if they gave the 'wrong' answer again.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Lord Ashcroft: My EU e... · 3 replies · +1 points

And what would the question(s) of a second referendum be? May's 'deal' is dead in the water, the EU are unlikely to offer a different deal while we are still in the EU, and we have already answered the basic Remain/Leave question. On top of that you also have the suspicion of many of the referendate that the 'results' might not be honoured if they gave the 'wrong' answer again.

Far better, in my opinion, to accept the default 'no deal' leave option on 31 October and then negotiate trade and relationship terms with the EU. This is in fact your 'building a Brexit negotiating position that has majority support' concept, but post Brexit, not from the inside looking out through the prison bars.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Divided Britain · 2 replies · +1 points

But how will that play out among current Conservative MPs? Despite many wanting any soft Brexit, they have no champion with May gone, and her WA is tainted with failure. Even those wanting a softer Brexit may be persuaded or compelled to exit first (almost certainly no deal) and negotiate trade and other deals afterwards.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: The Tory... · 0 replies · +1 points

"The WA is NOT BREXIT"

Quite so. It is crashing out into a Hard Remain with all the obligations but fewer benefits than the satutus quo Remain.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: The Tory... · 5 replies · +1 points

Where the Referendum 'went wrong' was that the Government was expected to deliver a Leave result but spent the last 3 years trying to thwart it (ably backed by the rEU).

There is now a political mess to be resolved, and unfortunately the Conservatives seem to be unwilling to resolve it.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Henry Newman: The Tory... · 2 replies · +1 points

It is still the default option in law, voted for by a majority of MPs, and not invalidated by the Cooper-Letwin Act.

4 years ago @ http://www.conservativ... - Greig Baker: Reflectio... · 1 reply · +1 points

What party could survive the reputation of deliberately accepting a 'bad' deal? Especially when the Withdrawal Treaty sets the UK up for a crash into an inescapable Remain that is harder than a status quo Remain.

I'm afraid that the question of Remain or Leave is not amenable to resolution by existing party politics. We had a Referendum because of that. May's deception of trying to be all things to all people has resulted in the unholy mess we see today.

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