en-us https://www.intensedebate.com/users/785464 Comments by ConcernedMLMer http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/03/01/mlm-leadership-is-more-than-just-a-ranked-postion-it-comes-from-the-heart/#IDComment59703471 Troy, In many cases we do need to support "each other" as fellow Network Marketers. However, there is a certain breed of Networker that I DO NOT want to associate myself with and one that I feel needs to be held accountable. This breed of Networker uses the hopes and dreams of amazing people to suck those people in to incredibly unstable opportunities, simply to generate income. You know the pre-launch re-runs that I'm talking about. We see them every year. Certain people go from pre-launch to pre-launch creating a buzz and hype, sucker thousands out of millions of dollars, shut it down and then change the name of the opportunity and do it again the next year. These scammers hide behind the legitimate name of our profession yet they undermine it with their unethical behavior and actions. Unfortunately I cannot sit by and support these people as fellow Networkers, just because they're in the same industry. And neither can you - which is one of the reasons I believe you have this community - to expose that hype and those companies that seek to damage our industry. Accountability is what I call it. If a company is going to use hype to recruit then they should stand accountable to questions and concerns. Exposing those concerns is our right and quite frankly is just darn smart. Your site alone has probably helped A LOT of people save their money and reputations by exposing these scams for what they are. Calling those companies out is not bashing them. It's holding them accountable. Every great company (just like every great leader) should be held accountable. If a company resists it then I think that company has something to hide. Keep up the great work. Thank you for all you do! Thu, 4 Mar 2010 07:58:59 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/03/01/mlm-leadership-is-more-than-just-a-ranked-postion-it-comes-from-the-heart/#IDComment59703471 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/03/03/panther-mobile-still-has-a-ways-to-go-in-the-mlm-wireless-wars/#IDComment59702190 Troy, I appreciate what you do for this industry. I'm an optimist. I like to think that people set out to do good and circumstances that can be out of their control cause problems to happen. When Global Verge first came out with Buzzirk/Zer01 I said, "I welcome the technology, bring it on." But I threw caution regarding the lack of infrastructure that Global Verge had to supply the MLM side (the side that paid the checks). Of course I was called a hater (because I was in a competing company) and I was told that soon "I would see that Global Verge would be the strongest company in MLM." That was told to me by some pretty serious "players" in the MLM world. Well, I guess we can all agree they were wrong. My hope is that Panther is able to provide what they say they will provide. But as I said before with Global Verge, just because someone says they are going to do something doesn't mean they have the actual ability to follow through with it in an MLM setting. Running a traditional wireless business and an MLM wireless business are two completely different things. Having a cell phone deal means nothing. You need rep support, proper legal counsel, a strong MLM commission reporting system, a solid accounting system to ensure commissions are run properly and paid promptly. This list (as you know Troy) goes on and on. I hope Panther is able to pull off what they are promising to people. But I will caution those that are being sucked in by the hype to open your eyes and look at the entire infrastructure you're going to be aligning your efforts with. In other words, don't make an emotional decision, make a business minded decision. Any idea for a company is not enough in these economic times! I know, all the Panther people will call me a hater. Well guys, I'm not here mentioning any other company names. I'm not linking to any websites or blogs here. Just someone that loves the MLM profession (particularly the telecom side) and doing my part to help protect it. I wish the Panther Mobile opportunity the best of luck trying to make a go at this. I'm pulling for you. I truly am - for the good of the MLM profession! Thu, 4 Mar 2010 07:43:39 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/03/03/panther-mobile-still-has-a-ways-to-go-in-the-mlm-wireless-wars/#IDComment59702190 http://mlmhelpdesk.com/wow-mobile-shut-off-by-t-mobile-hear-the-real-story-here/#IDComment58750722 I don't think it was the Lightyear leader that Troy was referring to in his video. No Lightyear rep ever said anything about T-Mobile and WOW. You'd have to ask Mr. Panther about that one! Fri, 26 Feb 2010 05:13:38 +0000 http://mlmhelpdesk.com/wow-mobile-shut-off-by-t-mobile-hear-the-real-story-here/#IDComment58750722 http://mlmhelpdesk.com/wow-mobile-shut-off-by-t-mobile-hear-the-real-story-here/#IDComment58750647 What makes you think he's one of the most respected people in telecom? What accomplishes has he had other than having his previous telecom MLM shut down by the feds? Fri, 26 Feb 2010 05:12:33 +0000 http://mlmhelpdesk.com/wow-mobile-shut-off-by-t-mobile-hear-the-real-story-here/#IDComment58750647 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/06/20/lightyear-wireless-lost-top-mlm-leaders-reco-shanee-mcdaniel/#IDComment58705817 Have you ever built a large MLM business with a telecom MLM company? I'm curious because usually it's people who have never done this that say things like "there's no residual in it" or that "all the money is in upfront bonuses." Hate to brake it to you but 70% of my income comes from ongoing monthly residuals from the services my team uses! And as far as the price wars go. Let them go on! The more competitive the services get the more people will start to use MORE stuff (voice, text, data), etc. The future of wireless is EXTREMELY bright as we're just getting started in the states! 10 years from now I hope that every rep on my team gets to pay $50 a month for unlimited everything and can take their phone with them anywhere they want in the world (WiMax will be HUGE). I'll take 4% of $50 x tens of thousands of reps' bills over 3% to 4% of $150 juice that people will drop in 30 days! Next. Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:57:38 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/06/20/lightyear-wireless-lost-top-mlm-leaders-reco-shanee-mcdaniel/#IDComment58705817 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/18/breaking-mlm-news-global-verge-former-ceo-and-cfo-break-their-silence/#IDComment58538429 This is the letter that GV corporate sent to their reps??? Are you kidding me? What I find hysterical here is that not one of the reps that joined Global Verge over the last year did any of this! LOL!!!! Wed, 24 Feb 2010 20:22:40 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/18/breaking-mlm-news-global-verge-former-ceo-and-cfo-break-their-silence/#IDComment58538429 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58506098 FDI Agent, You're a funny guy. Spoken like someone who truly doesn't understand what they are talking about. You do realize that Lightyear has already been in business for 16 years don't you? They didn't use MLM to "get started". They were in telecom for many years and already had a successful run. Wireless is their future and they are taking steps to focus more on that than what they had been for 16 years. Direct Sales and MLM is their only means of customer acquisition. Why would they cast away their customer gathering model?????? MLM companies that are public don't go out of business or get rid of the MLM model because they are public. They get rid of the MLM model because the ownership wants nothing to do with MLM. As you have seen from Sherm and Josh they've had their hand in the MLM world for many years. First as a DSA supplier (supplying services wholesale to companies like Melaleuca, Amway, Excel, World Connect, etc), then in their own MLM company. They also built their commercial sales division with Direct Sales Agents (not with marketing and advertising). Sorry to break it to you but this move was done to empower the reps. Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:40:04 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58506098 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58505616 Great replies Troy. They are appreciated. I look forward to an incredible next 3 to 5 years in Lightyear. They are going to take some massive steps with acquisition and expansion which will give an already amazing opportunity even more staying power. Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:35:12 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58505616 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58427192 Troy, You are absolutely right - Sherm is a winner! Everything he's said he would do he's done. This step will give Lightyear an amazing step into our future! Wed, 24 Feb 2010 00:35:18 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/23/breaking-mlm-telecommunication-news-sherm-henderson-takes-lightyear-network-solutions-public/#IDComment58427192 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment58241534 You're exactly right. The Global Group leaders were very aware that Mark and Ted could not handle what was going on. But they really didn't care. "As long as we're getting paid we're sticking it out" is what I was told from one of their top dogs. They knew that Mark and Ted had no idea of what they were doing. They knew about many of the lies (they even spewed a few themselves). Yet they continued to string people along - earning their checks, while they put together their back up plan (their own company). I can't wait to see this. Another train wreck, waiting to happen. What happen to people's ethics and morals? Mon, 22 Feb 2010 19:55:39 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment58241534 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57166049 It's really sad Chris. It's sad because for a long time people have been warning that this was coming (just based on the past of Global Verge founders). Yet we were called "haters" and people said that we were just threatened by the incredible Global Verge opportunity. No, we were just better at evaluating a business than them and we saw this coming. Wed, 17 Feb 2010 02:53:53 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57166049 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57122591 Chris, First I want to say that I respect 100% that you come right out and say that you're busy and a little understaffed. That's very refreshing and I give you kudos for that! However, I do want to give you some advice (as I'm not sure about your experience in the MLM industry). One of the main reason that MLM companies don't make it past the 6th month mark is because they have a very poor business plan. In other words they aren't already staffed and set up to launch a business. I love the fact that you're trying to bring a good product to people that were scammed by Global Verge. I respect that 100%. But I am going to caution you to not hype the heck out of your deal just to swing people over if you can't handle the load. The reason being is that you're going to get overwhelmed and more people are going to get let down. Most companies that start an MLM operation have an infrastructure already in place to help support a thriving business. I think you've got a great product and I just hate to see people struggle with the MLM companies they join. I wish you the best! Tue, 16 Feb 2010 20:26:54 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57122591 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57121831 Well I personally listened in on a couple of conference calls where Mark was talking with Chris and let's just say Chris is just as guilty for dishing out the GV hype. Tue, 16 Feb 2010 20:19:09 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57121831 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57011732 Chris, I'm curious about something. If Global Verge had followed through with paying you, would you have stuck with them or would you have done the right thing and exposed the lies you knew were happening right before your eyes? I only ask because it wasn't until you weren't getting paid that you decided to go your separate way. Tue, 16 Feb 2010 01:41:57 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/02/mlm-help-desk-and-troy-dooly-officially-responds-to-global-verge-through-mlm-attorney-kevin-thompson/#IDComment57011732 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56705946 You see Troy, that's my frustration. History has shown us many things, especially over the last few years in regards to Telecom MLM. Companies that have lacked the infrastructure to pull off what they hype up end up hurting the industry. Do you agreee or disagree with that? While I agree that we don't need to bash or "dog" other companies, I don't feel that's what I'm doing here. I'll admit that my frustration that my great company has been lumped in with the sludge that has transpired over the last 24 months sometimes leads to me being pretty critical whenever I see hype. Absolutely I admit that. But my question is, don't you think that with everything that has happened to the telecom MLM world in the last couple of years that people deserve the right to be a little more critical of the hype being thrown around? Call it bashing or dogging, I call it accountability. I don't think companies should go around lying and hyping their opportunity up then when they can't deliver and then expect people to forget about it. It happened with Global Verge many times, it happened with FDI, and it aslo happened with WOW/Liberty. I think Network Marketers MUST hold their upline leadership and companies accountable for their actions. I think it will lead to many more people making better educated decisions. Anyway, I will do my best not to come off as dogging but I won't ever stop holding these people accountable for what they are promising to the MLM world! Sat, 13 Feb 2010 20:57:32 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56705946 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56656914 Troy, As an MLM advocate I feel a responsibility to help protect our industry from the opportunities that lead to the negative reputation MLM receives. This doesn't stem from bitterness, it stems for a love of my profession. It isn't about bashing. It isn't about a pissing contest. It's about helping people make an educated decision. Please recall, I NEVER brought Lightyear into the WOW conversation. It was a WOW poster that did that. He assumed I was in Lightyear (based on previous posts elsewhere) and decided to take a shot at Lightyear (a negative bash of the company). I defended it, plain and simple. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on the virtual company thing. To me it does not seem like a secure way to run a business. I try to imagine people building in a virtual MLM nutritional company and I just can't see it. You really think a leader is going to feel secure that the company that controls their livelihood doesn't even have a corporate office???? Why would a service based business be any different? You still need to have A LOT of phones in stock, ready to ship. You still need to have staff on hand that can monitor billing, servicing, support (customer and rep). Your IT department needs to be able to get into a room together and draw out the directional flow of ordering sites. To not have all of that under one roof spells insecurity to me. But hey, that's just my opinion. I wish WOW the best, for the good of the industry. But just remember, it was the WOW reps that bashed Lightyear, not the other way around. No one ever bashed WOW with negativity. All that was brought up was valid questions about the security of the infrastructure, the integrity of their leadership, and legitimacy of the product. That isn't bashing, that's discussing a company to help bring to light the ENTIRE picture of an opportunity. Isn't that why you have this forum? Sat, 13 Feb 2010 16:22:57 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56656914 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/04/mlm-wireless-wars-wow-mobile-founder-randy-jeffers-announces-the-velocity-project/#IDComment56655341 Thanks for contributing helpful content to a good conversation. So, how about some answers to the questions? Sat, 13 Feb 2010 16:09:31 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/02/04/mlm-wireless-wars-wow-mobile-founder-randy-jeffers-announces-the-velocity-project/#IDComment56655341 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56610122 I'm just so surprised at how much latitude you give to Liberty. I mean look at what's happened with Global Verge, EDT, LPC Global, the first round of Liberty's VOIP/WOW WiFi VOIP. I would think that you'd be more of a skeptic than anyone when it comes to the legitimacy of the WOW/Liberty infrastructure. I understand you've spoken to Randy and you're holding a WOW phone in your hand. But did it ever occur that the phone you're holding is simply a T-Mobile phone that has been cracked with the WOW tethering software? Where's their customer service? Where can I go as a leader to see their infrastructure, meet their employees, tour their facility? These are things that any serious builder would do if they're going to invest their time and money into building a long lasting MLM business. In the last week I've spoken to 11 WOW marketers who claim to have made "significant income" in other deals. Not one of them even knows what the corporate address is. Not one can tell me how many employees are on hand. Not one even knew about Randy's Destiny Telecom debacle. As an MLM advocate, aren't these fair questions? Are you honestly telling me that you buy this "virtual company" concept? Troy, you've been in this industry a long time. Can you show me one MLM company that has succeeded (not just been around but become a force in the industry) with no corporate facility, employees, accounting, shipping, tech support, etc? Here's why I ask. Liberty International has been an MLM company operating under this "virtual company" concept for 10 years now, right? So, if this is the "future" of the way companies are going to do business, why has no one ever heard of Liberty International? What I'm saying is that it is my opinion that because of their lack of corporate infrastructure that I don't think they've been able to support any kind of sustainable growth. My concern is that now with the attention that wireless is bringing them that we're going to see another Global Verge situation on our hands - waiting months and months for phones, excuses upon excuses, and yet another black eye for the MLM industry. I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from here. Sat, 13 Feb 2010 07:44:02 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56610122 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56594066 Troy, I'm curious, have you joined as a rep for WOW? Sat, 13 Feb 2010 04:08:12 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56594066 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56566993 In WOW you don't get it forever, you get it as long as the 3 customers/reps you recruit don't drop off their service! Remember, it's pre-paid so it's easy for that to happen. If one of those drop out then you are charged again! Lightyear doesn't give it free forever. For every 2 reps you recruit not only do you make $200 in upfront bonuses, but you also earn $100 off your wireless bill (you earn credits that can be applied to your bill or any other customer you want). So if you recruit 4 reps in a month you get $200 off your bill. Recruit 6 and get $300, etc. There's no limit to the amount of free credits you can earn. I have not had to pay a cell phone bill out of my own pocket since I became my own customer with Lightyear 19 months ago! In addition to that I'm able to pay the cell phone bill of 7 of my own personal customers (these are not reps, just people using the service, they paid no fee to join the comp plan). So let's ask how WOW is able to pay for a free cell phone bill when 3 are activated. It's simple math really. WOW charges the person $25 just to become a user of the service. They also charge $25 to port the number (Lightyear doesn't charge for either of those). Then WOW is charging $89 a month for a service that Lightyear offers for $59. I'm sure if WOW actually does have a wholesale deal with T-Mobile that they're getting the service for at least $60. So with a $30 profit per customer x 3 = $90. There's your free cell phone service. The bummer thing is that there will ALWAYS be people paying a bill. It's impossible for everyone to get free service. If you recruit 10 reps personally and they want free service, they need to go recruit 3 each. That's 30 people that aren't getting free service so the 10 can. So for you to get yours free you need to recruit 3 people to spend $25 to be a rep, $25 to port their number, $25 to get a SIM Card (or $300+ for a new phone), $89 for the service, etc. I'm sorry, but I don't see a lot of people having success with that. Fri, 12 Feb 2010 23:44:59 +0000 http://www.mlmhelpdesk.com/2009/12/02/lightyear-wireless-the-next-billion-dollar-mlm-telecommunication-company/#IDComment56566993