I have nothing to say other than I really, really enjoyed this two-part interview. I, too, am really looking forward to reading the research when it is published.

Any chance Buddhist Geeks could notify us readers when the research finds its way to publication?

Outstanding, Hokai!

Joel and Kenneth, I appreciate your having brought up the truth of "no escape." Sometimes meditation will lead us into some really dark, uncomfortable conditions. When this happens, I'm sure most of us think, "If I stop this, the anguish will stop." So we try that, and it doesn't work. As you said, surrender to the experience is the only way through it. Rumi's "Guest House" poem was really helpful for me the first time I went through this territory, because it encouraged me to invite the good, the bad, and the ugly into my awareness without hesitation. It's a tough lesson to learn, and we learn it over and over and over again (well, if you're stubborn like me!).

"It's been 40 years of serious dharma practice now in the West. *Are* Westerners waking up? If so, why aren't we talking about it? If not, why not?"

Some people are talking about it, though I'm sure it doesn't happen as much as it could (or dare I say, should). It seems like very few modern Westerners, or even modern Easterners, will make outright claims to awakening. And yet, we have very skillful teachers from both East and West teaching very high level dharma, speaking from what appears to be direct personal experience. Some more transparency would be nice, perhaps ideal. For now, I'm afraid we will mostly have to read between the lines.

And frankly, it can be difficult to decipher whether any claim to enlightenment/awakening is the real thing or just plain B.S. The B.S. claims hurt more than they help, which makes the practice of making claims all that much less appealing. For better or for worse, it seems as though many teachers just choose to opt out of claiming in favor of letting the Dharma speak for itself.

While the mainstream media continues to distract us from issues that matter, you, Dr. Paul, are getting the word out about the inherent corruption of the State. I can't thank you enough.

"The means of realization and the realized mind are not separate."

Thank you for the reminder.

What a great interview!

I look forward to witnessing the ways in which the Eastern and Western paths converge as a uniquely Western dharma continues to emerge.

I appreciate Bachelor's attention to detail in regards to the facets of the Buddha's teaching (at least that of the Pali canon) that appear to be totally unique from the going spiritual traditions in India during the Buddha's life. This is an important thing to do in any type of in-depth scholarship.

What I don't like about his approach is that he seems to be attempting to shed all of the Buddha's cultural influences, as if the Buddha could have fully escaped them in his day. This is the same kind of scholarship that figures like John Dominic Crossan and Marcus Borg apply to the teachings of Jesus in the Christian New Testament. They more or less deny that Jesus would have said anything that anyone else would have said before, and thus only consider a small handful of sayings and teachings in the NT as possibly coming from him.

In essence, a severe consequence (however unintended) of this brand of exegetical scholarship reduces the historical figure into a sort of talking head. Rather than stripping the teachings of the Buddha, or even Jesus for that matter, from any teachings that resemble other teachings that were around in their time, we should at least take into account the fact that many of these redundancies may have been important to their overall message. However, once we feel that we have a good handle on the teachings of any important figure from any given text (as the message may change from text to text, as we see in both the Buddhist and Christian literature), we can freely choose to accept or reject those teachings based on whichever information we find to be more valid. We need not shave off the unsightly aspects of a tradition as if they were never there in order to value certain aspects of the tradition. We can acknowledge the whole catastrophe and allow wisdom to shine light on any aspects that need revision in today's evolving world.

As someone who is about to start an M.A. in counseling psychology program this Fall, I found this interview to be truly inspiring. Thank you, Trudy and Vince.

Emily, your writing is clear and easy to relate to. This piece is no exception. Well done!